Hmm, not that I recall. And this is a bit too specialized to get much attention. So yes, it's probably missing. Not that it is really difficult to do - you just need a few people and some time. After all matchmaking is like "there are currently XX players waiting for a game, take those with close scores that have not played against each other yet and let them play". It doesn't get much more difficult. Once you understand the ELO rating system in chess or the Swiss-system tournament (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swiss-system_tournament) there you have your matchmaking - you can probably create a good matchmaking everyhwere.

Actually, why are you looking for a free, perfect, open source alternative to GOG Galaxy? Isn't this a bit insane?

It's not the fact that GOG Galaxy is closed source that makes it a DRM, it's the fact that it's phoning home when used with some multiplayer games. That is the artificial step and that's what is making it plain, bad old DRM (not even stealth DRM), not how it is programmed. It's a simple as that. Neither the devs, nor GOG would need to phone home but they do and that means that if Galaxy wouldn't be DRM, then Steam wouldn't be either. Since Steam is by kind of agreement Galaxy must be too.

Just look at the GOG homepage, right in front: "Install and update your games with GOG Galaxy - the optional gaming client...." (optional gaming client emphasized by me)

And then on the gamecard of some games "Multiplayer Notice: Please note that the GOG Galaxy Client is required to access Multiplayer. " (GOG Galaxy is required emphasized by me)

You see the dissonance? That's the stealthy part actually. And I don't like GOG for being dishonest. Man, they were once such a nice company.

I never really said different ;), but it all started when somebody was making some claims were you filled in and provided some real info.
And I never heard prior really of any open source (ZeroMQ) either, whenever I read about gaming industry all claimed to have developed everything. So I just wanted to see if there are facts about that open source solutions to exist for MP.

So not really insane, but for information spreading rather than rumor spreading ;) And pointing to open source is ALWAYS a good solution, even if it would just reach 0.01% I would still say mission accomplished.
To shortly summarize I was asking for a non-DRM solution against DRM. I said that I do trust Galaxy/GOG more than other decs/publishers (IIRC you said you don't trust anyone ;) ). And out of this I was/am asking for open source (wanted to abbreviate to OS....) for the sake of a good informational argument to point others in the right direction (instead of you know what I mean.....)

And for the matchmaking: Some claimed that there are ready solutions existing as OS, but I have a hard tie imagining it, as you would always need a central server to keep this information. From what I have seen (hence my comparison to gamespy) Galaxy is trying to fill in this role of a 3rd party Independent solution and supporting it far longer as most devs do.
And as matchmaking is more and more a standard, see above, it would be really useful to have information about an OS solution.

Shortly back to Galaxy, yes it is DRM, but I can not think of a solution WITH matchmaking which would not have some DRM in it. You see from where I am coming? People want to have achievements, people want to have chat, dadadada, which ALL result in some form of DRM by definition, I think we agree here, or? How do you want to overcome it? What (working) alternatives are there?

The problem is that DRM is so vague, that you can use it too both extremes. But for comparison it would be good to see an OS solution.

Sorry for the lengthy reply.

PS: ZeroMQ is really fascinating ;)
PPS: For the license stuff: maybe wording, but I think you misunderstood my main point, the dev would need to sign off on it as well, and not sure if they would do it.....(outsourcing)

If you only ever play online with friends, you don't need a central server. Matchmaking is then done kind of manually. For MMOs you would like to have a server though. Renting servers nowadays is really easy. Amazon for example has tons of them. All you need is a small (not too biggish) programm that runs on the server and does the matchmaking. If this programm is freely distributable or bundled with your purchased game - there you have it, the solution WITH matchmaking and completely free of DRM. It's thinkable.

If however said programm is not freely available or is available but needs to call somewhere else before starting, well that's DRM then. And a nice definition of DRM in case of multiplayer games too.

In principle every computer connected to the internet can act as a server. Peer-to-peer file sharing is kind of an example of how a central server-less network can operate and exchange complex informations. It's however not something that needs to be implemented to make playing multiplayer computer games completely DRM free. Making the server freely distributable is already enough.

Otherwise, what if the game servers are turned off after some time? That happens frequently. If people are concerned about playing their single player games for a longer time, they should be concerned about playing their multiplayer games for a longer time too, I think.

Last point first:

Precisely!! As I pointed out prior, in the moment we all hing ONLY on the whim of a dev. Galaxy is trying to get a third party solution (and if you see how many oooold games they re-activated I do trust them a bit more with this than those devs). But the best would be having a OS solution right from the beginning.

For LAN/closed groups yes might work, but as we are talking quite often about anything but LAN (which still is a shame) as you also admitted you would need a server. Or a torrent maybe. hacking a torrent is also harder. (torrent for the database of the matchmaking database). BUT is it already DRM? (answer honestly ;) )

Supplied with the game, yes ideal (hence asking for OS links ;) )

A server isn't DRM. Being required to use GOG's or the publisher's servers which could lock me out for any reason, and especially for a reason such as not having the game I'm trying to play in my GOG library *is* DRM. AIUI that is happening right now; multiplayer implemented with Galaxy *will* check whether you have the game in your library. If you don't, you're locked out. Nothing stealthy about it.

Someone correct me if this isn't actually happening yet.

GOG *talks* like it's for DRM-free gaming, but *walks* like it's emulating Steam, which is where the money is -- or more money, anyway.

Do you get the feeling that the gaming industry is in the process of incorporating "online functionality" into everything as a means to effectively phase out true single-player functionality?

Clarry reaaaalx, take a deep breath please ;)

Getting kicked out anoooother can of worms ;)
And I am trying with a proper discussion trying to see IF there is even anything remotely existing.
As I stated before, as soon as you have a server, you need a database, once you have a database, is it DRM?

You just stormed in ;) and said it is. BUT any database needs a ID, so if you have to supply a (unique) ID, is it DRM? What ID would you suggest? Any method any ?????

(I will stop here for the moment out of a good reason ;)
You wont here me disagree all the way, but also for you try to answer my question ;) There is a reason for ;)
And it is a nice hype in the moment, like with achievements and and and

I don't know about trying to phase out true single player functionality, but it certainly seems like they're doing everything they can to tightly integrate your (especially online) gaming experience into a digital store that conveniently doubles as a gatekeeper to check whether you own the game or not. If you have a pirated copy of a steam only game with matchmaking and everything built using the steam apis, and no steam account, you're going to have a hell of a hard time trying to play that game online. That's a godsend for developers who have been fighting piracy tooth and nail for decades now. It makes for very effective DRM.
No, a database isn't DRM. Unique IDs aren't DRM.

Whenever you have to come up with an account name to register onto some website, you're coming up with your own unique ID. In other cases, such IDs can be generated automatically for you. For example, Wolfenstein: Enemy Territory (a free multiplayer shooter) will generate a unique ID for you upon installation or first run. Using that ID, servers can recognize you and store statistics about you into their database -- like kill count, accuracy, amount of time played, etc. If you want, you can regenerate a new unique ID. The important thing is that you are in charge of your own IDs, and they are not linked to information that would be used for authentication in the DRM sense. That would be information like "has the user with this ID [that he has no control over] bought this game on gog.com? Does he have the right to play the game? If not, we don't let him connect to an online match".

In an ideal world, I should be able to opt out of any such database, or at least choose to use one hosted by me or a third party. But a database by itself is not DRM.

I'm an old fart so achievements are something for little kids. They're all yours, and good riddance. ;p

I appreciate that other people feel differently, but I struggle to understand why anyone would willingly put up with DRM for the sake of something so trivial. But I know that most people think cloud storage is the equivalent of an HDD, so I probably shouldn't.

Achievements can be made optional (as some games have it). Achievements can be implemented client side. Terraria (here on gog) does that, for example. Even if I wanted to store my achievement data "in the cloud", it's not inherently DRM. The question is, am I being controlled or am I in control?

There is also the question of whether you, or I, care about being in control of what is rightfully ours to control. Convenience is something that has methodically and efficiently led many to believe that such a right is of little or no significance. And so it goes.

Indeed. People make their own decisions regarding DRM, and it is hard to argue about that. Not that I really need to; I let people have their opinions, and I try to respect them. But advocating for DRM-free doesn't impede on the rights of other gamers, while gamers who collectively accept DRM are showing a lack of empathy towards people with different values. Even so, it's not my choice to make.

So what really irritates me especially on GOG is the hypocrisy and double standards. GOG boldly advertises that their games are DRM free, right there on the front page. But they have DRM! People just go bend the definitions then. They say it's not DRM because they don't care about multiplayer. Or it's not DRM because they enjoy the DRM free part of the game. Or it's not DRM because GOG is storing your achievements "in the cloud" in addition to checking whther you own and have a right to play the game online. Or it's not DRM "because you have to be online anyway" (since when did DRM have anything to do with being online? Your DVDs and Blurays have DRM, a part of which is implemented in the bluray player, offline). Or whatever else. It's quite dishonest. Let's call it what it is. If you like DRM, well, I'm sad about that, but that's ultimately not my issue. Just don't wave that big DRM free flag in the DRM bandwagon.

SO both of you agree that the sever itself is not yet DRM.

I admit I haven't tried, but do we already know for sure, that other NON-GOG games might not run over Galaxy as well?

Hence I omitted it from my original post ;) I know a wee bit of a trap ;)

Am I afraid that they might do DRM with it, yes, BUT to what extend, we do not know yet, or? Please be honest ;)

And me and serpantino wanted to have such a discussion as we are having in the moment. A nice discussion, yes me might just end up agreeing that we disagree on which level DRM is implemented (or not), but more as a way to spread information and not just the usual way ;)

And I just saw, I sometimes really love the forum SW (NovHak, I miseed you reply, will be back to you, sorry guys)

Achievements I couldn't agree more. ;)
Back to Galaxy: I admit I have never tried to play a non-GOG game via galaxy, but I do doubt it well ever work, although we do NOT know yet, maybe it is just a part to be integrated later (like also with some older games (one of the older star wars MP titles....can't remember the name)
So for the final war cry, don't you think it might be a bit too early? ;) Nothing wrong with keeping a discussion alive though!!

I do see all the other build in ones though? Do you have some more background info? (yes worst case I do accept french as well ;) )
No, this is a windows bug. Windows was never good with anything but English.....Can't remember all the way, but if you have a username with strange characters even notepad or similar has problems (like with a direct print command), if really interested I would try to find it, as mentioned they dig it down, really down.
Asian characters, I was mainly talking about typing not opening, but same principle, just the other way round and NOT using really special characters, only translating/converting them...
Yeah nice long list ;) Wasn't it all supposed to be centralised into my documents ;) (or at least what MS claims)
And some of those are not even accessible if you do not have the rights, what a normal user shall not have (sorry couldn't resist ;) )
Yes, sorry that I omitted. I did check for at least two and no they weren't there, I couldn't find them right away anywhere in the reg. (I tried with AI war, but the name is....you know what I mean) so I used Tropico 4.
But as the users are setup during install, it shall be the installers causing it, not the reg, or?

I learned some time ago that blurays are pointless on windows. And equally pointless to think that your local retailer wouldn't sell you one anyway.

I'm well past the point of being outraged by the Steams and GOG's of this world. What we see today started a long time ago. While the frog-in-the-pot analogy isn't valid in a literal sense, it is nonetheless a figuratively perfect depiction of what has occurred. So I don't let it bother me too much.