There was a story a few years back about a kid who played violent video games, IIRC it was Manhunter, where you can kill someone with a wrench. This kid was killed by some other kids who beat him with a wrench. Someone tried to blame the death on the video games played by the victim. Screwed up people are going to do some screwed up stuff. If before they do it the choose to play a violent video game, or read a horror book or watch some ultra violent movie, has no bearing on how screwed up they were before that.

On a lighter note I saw an example of the exact opposite mentality regarding age appropriate video games. My sister was going to buy some games for my nephew. She was very adamant about only buying games that were rated E (for Everyone) and was quite upset that some of the games were way too complicated for young children. No, there was nothing inappropriate in the games that kids shouldn't see (which is what the rating system is for) but the games were obviously made for older players who have the necessary cognitive functions and levels of patience to handle some of the more complicated and in depth gameplay.

Here in Germany it's been the same issue. Next to the US, Germany has one of the most ingrained gun cultures in Europe (next to Finland). We've had three major school shootings in Germany in the last ten years - one in Erfurt, one in Emsdetten and one in Winnenden. Each one has been mercilessly exploited by self-serving politicians here to further their political goals, one of which has been to promote hatred and intolerance of gaming.

Now, while little is known about Robert Steinhäuser or Bastian B., the media did decide in all three cases on focus on their playing of violent video games, which has been politicised with the term "killer games" here, failing to even remotely address the combination of his having psychiatric problems and having ready access to the fifteen weapons kept openly at home by his father, who also actively encouraged his son to get enthusiastic about guns by building a shooting range in their basement for him.

So video games have a kiddy perception because normal adults can't use Japanese consoles comfortably. Okay there.

and the wonder why kids are out of control i blame the parents for this one. I mean if you are going to give your children a nasty game give them fallout 3 with heads exploding and other carnage.

Seriously though i think the parents should stop allowing kids to play hardcore games with a lot of killings in it.

No, but I think that really doesn't help much in that regards. When the accessories are so small that you can hit buttons on the opposite side of the controller when you're holding it as intended, that does tend to encourage the idea that it's for kids.

I don't really have any idea as to what really caused what. I think it's more likely just a coincidence as the older controllers from early on weren't really that much better even though the audience seemed older.

@jamyskis and Stevedog13, that's precisely the point, I have yet to hear of one of these cases where the murder wasn't already fairly far gone. It's natural and healthy to debate a bit about firearms and how the mentally ill are treated, but there should be some reasonable connection made.

Making political hay out of things while there are still bodies to be buried disgusts me and probably anybody with any decency.

In Seattle the problem isn't people, it's guns. The crime wave we've had lately wouldn't have been possible with knives or really anything else. In fact most of the crimes that have really concerned folks in recent years were gun crimes.

Now there were a couple of horrific knife attacks, but good luck getting people's knives away, there are just way too many legitimate uses for knives and if I've learned anything from the BBC it's that complete bans on types of weapons don't use.

Little story-time again. On Saturday I was in a small party (also for families, not a booze party) where there were people I don't know. Suddenly this small kid (6 years old boy) that I don't know comes to me asking:

"Hey that game where you take cars, how do you get to the man who is in a dead end and your police car can't fit it, so how do you get there?"

I had no idea what he was talking about and why did he come to ask me, but instinctively I asked "Do you mean the Grand Theft Auto games?". And sure he did, he specified GTA2, but I was still a bit unsure whether he really meant GTA2, or some of the newer GTA games.

Anyway, I didn't know the answer to his question (unless going there on foot), so he went on to talk about some other car game where you are supposed to hit other cars, and there's a picture of a yellow car in the game box. I first asked whether he is talking about Twisted Metal or Carmageddon, but he later specified it was a XBox game (the black one, ie. older), so I was thinking maybe he was talking about some Burnout game or whatever.

There's really no point to this story, other than I was wondering about a 6 years old boy playing Grand Theft Auto games, and I wondered how the heck he came to ask about games from me? Does it show that I like games, even though I am an old dog?

When I was a kid, we never shot or mugged people. Only spaceships and aliens.

as well as tanks, submarines and aircrafts. And even when we got people to shoot at, they were obvious bad guys ( Wolfenstein 3D)

That's why GTA ( the first) got so much attention back in time. It somehow was one of the games that crossed the line : the people that got shot or whatever were ordinary people.

where did those answers give the idea that video games are only meant for children? Yeah they talked about kids playing videogames ... because the question was about 10 year olds

When I was a kid, I stabbed evil Soviets with a knife (Green Beret), repeatedly punched and kicked people in the face (Street Fighter 2, Fatal Fury, Double Dragon), drove irresponsibly on public roads (Lotus Turbo Challenge 2, Outrun) and mowed down enemy troops with machine gun fire with little regard for the loss of innocent POW lives (Commando).

What's the difference from today? Blood and death. We weren't shielded from the actions, we were shielded from the consequences. Games like that didn't show that if you stabbed someone, they would bleed to death and die. They didn't show that if you drove 180km/h down a country road, that you would more than likely kill yourself and others.

The difference with modern gaming is not that they have become more violent, but that they show the consequences of such actions in more detail.

I always thought that was because people with big hands can use small controllers but people with small hands can't use big controllers... wasn't that what the main complaint was about the original Xbox controller?

Though I have to admit, the (para)phrase "That's for kids because the part I'd have to hold is small" has connotations that make me chuckle.
First thing that came to mind was Sniper Elite V2 and its kill-cam.

Not really, I eventually got sort of used to the PS3 controller, but I get constant hand cramps from the positioning of the various buttons.And I have to hold the controller extremely loosely otherwise I end up with cramps.

on top of that, my fingers have a tendency to jam up because the placement of the various controls assumes that you've got small hands.

It's not just that it's the default controller, it's that Sony refuses to recognize that there's a need for properly sized controllers. They could easily make it larger without making it inaccessible to people with smaller hands, you don't have to get your fingers all the way around the controller to grip it with.

The Wiimote is even worse, the lanyard is supposed to be a safety device, not a replacement for a properly sized controller that one can grip.

Yeah, that makes sense. It'd be like there only being one size of mouse.. the small ones you use for laptops.

The controllers are a relative inconvenience compared with things like stairs, water fountains, car head and leg room, door width and such.What's really bad is that I'm not really that tall, I'm pretty much smack dab average. I feel really sorry for my brother who is, 6' 3", I think.

Unfortunately, those aren't so easily solved by switching out a relatively inexpensive part. I really should look into haxxoring my PS3 to accept my XBox controller. As that's a ton more comfortable.

It sucks not being able to enjoy playing a game because the controller sucks.

EDIT: OTOH, giant mouses and tiny mouses are generally less of an issue as you just have to be able to keep your fingers properly positioned and move the mouse as needed. Sine they're generally designed for on a desk it's a lot easier to work with an awkwardly sized one.

Well, as long as it's not too awkwardly shaped like those hockey puck mouses that Apple was selling for a while. Those were some of the worst I've ever used.

EDIT2: Looks like it is possible to use an XBox360 controller with PS3, which I had known about that previously. http://www.xcmlive.com/cgi-bin/xcmlive/engine.pl?function=viewid&id=RKS000165

They're as "comfortable" as any of the tiny laptop mice I've used. I need to hold both with just the fingertips, fingers curled together (I much prefer big ones like Logitech's Revolution MX, or trackballs like Microsoft's Trackball Explorer, where the whole hand can rest on the device, not the tabletop). Actually, the Apple puck feels better than the laptop mice, since it's at least wider,so the fingers don't have to be that curled.