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Navagon: Superman really should just have stayed dead, really. I don't see the merit in a character that powerful and even with the rewrites he's still out of date.
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orcishgamer: For the same reasons I don't think Captain America is a good character anymore, both were written for what you'd consider 40s-50s sensibilities. Yes, I agree, they had an acceptable ending for him, they should have kept it that way.
Captain America is a little different, he was always supposed to be anachronistic. His story began as a WWII-era hero, but then he was frozen for... I think they are going with 40+ years now... only to re-awaken in a modern world that he is no longer relevant to. His 1940's sensibilities are supposed to highlight the changes in modern society.
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orcishgamer: For the same reasons I don't think Captain America is a good character anymore, both were written for what you'd consider 40s-50s sensibilities. Yes, I agree, they had an acceptable ending for him, they should have kept it that way.
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Navagon: Ideally they should stick to heroes that are relevant to the age we're living in. The reason Batman still works is because he's flawed and potentially vulnerable. There's also a nice array of gadgets and bad guys too.
The 60s era was a golden age, we finally had super heroes that weren't self confident, that had issues with their powers, that had trouble deciding what was right and what was wrong, and that had to essentially construct their own moral code in some cases.

These heroes remain relevant today because we can identify with all these things. Superman is just a heroic policeman and Captain America is a heroic soldier. We don't identify with those today.

Now think of The Incredible Hulk (Bruce Banner), The Fantastic Four, Spiderman, Batman, The X-Men, etc. We can identify with all of these. The villains in some of these even become more interesting. The Green Goblin is disturbingly tragic. Magneto can't help but to reveal his conscience at times as well as his love for Prof. Xavier (which might be brotherly or amorous, I'm not sure). You even have dynamics like Batman vs. The Joker, both are batshit insane (pardon the pun:) ).

Yep, the latter are definitely much more interesting as story material goes.
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cogadh: Basically, what was supposed to be a built-in flaw in the character (constantly growing power requires constantly stricter control) has become a major flaw in the story telling that the writers just can't seem to get away from.
The trouble with Superman and his ability to keep increasing in power is that DC then have to keep making the opponents strong enough to potentially beat him. It's one of the reasons I was more a Marvel fan because there are so many god-tier beings in DC usually directly because of Superman. If someone like Darksied or Black Adam found themselves on Earth-616 then the superhuman population of the Marvel universe would quickly be decimated.

DC also push Superman as one of the most important people in their universe so characters that are just as strong tend to get pushed to the kerb like Martian Manhunter or Captain Marvel.
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Delixe: Darksied
You have a point, that character is a god in every sense. They have a few yarns where Batman manages to outsmart him, but it takes Superman power to actually fight him.
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orcishgamer: These heroes remain relevant today because we can identify with all these things. Superman is just a heroic policeman and Captain America is a heroic soldier. We don't identify with those today.
Agreed with Superman but not with Wing-head. Captain America is just as relevent because of his origin. He was frozen in the 40's so writers can have the Avengers find him in any decade and Cap would be the same. Part of the appeal of Captain America is he strives for an ideal based on what he thinks America should be, not what it actually is. That makes him an icon that other Marvel characters can look to for inspiration of what a hero should be. Some of Captain America's best stories have been the ones where he has actually had to go against the government like Civil War.
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Delixe: If someone like Darksied or Black Adam found themselves on Earth-616 then the superhuman population of the Marvel universe would quickly be decimated.
Unless they run into the Beyonder or Phoenix or Proteus or Mikhail Rasputin or Apocalypse or Odin or Galactus or Eternity or Captain Universe or whoever happens to be wearing the Infinity Gauntlet this year... I could go on. The Marvel Universe has more than its fair share of over-powered god-like beings that are more than a match for their DC counterparts. The only difference is, in most cases the Marvel characters were created in response to an entire team that was too powerful to face "normal" comic book enemies, rather than an individual character who was too powerful.
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cogadh: The only difference is, in most cases the Marvel characters were created in response to an entire team that was too powerful to face "normal" comic book enemies, rather than an individual character who was too powerful.
You also missed Thanos who is a menace even without the gauntlet. Those characters were enemies of entire teams, X-Men, Avengers, hell the entire Marvel Universe. Darksied for example is purely there to challenge Superman, nobody else seems to even have a chance not even in a team. When DC characters turn up in force it's usually something so stupidly powerful like Monarch. It just seems to me that god-tier is far more common in DC and that is a direct result of the presence of Blue boy.
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cogadh: The only difference is, in most cases the Marvel characters were created in response to an entire team that was too powerful to face "normal" comic book enemies, rather than an individual character who was too powerful.
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Delixe: You also missed Thanos who is a menace even without the gauntlet. Those characters were enemies of entire teams, X-Men, Avengers, hell the entire Marvel Universe. Darksied for example is purely there to challenge Superman, nobody else seems to even have a chance not even in a team. When DC characters turn up in force it's usually something so stupidly powerful like Monarch. It just seems to me that god-tier is far more common in DC and that is a direct result of the presence of Blue boy.
Darkseid was technically created as the enemy of the New Gods, Superman just kind of adopted him as an enemy when his war with the New Gods spilled over into Earth. While Darkseid may be more powerful than most of the heroes on Earth, he is certainly not the most powerful being in the DC universe and not just there for Superman to fight. In fact, his final defeat didn't even come at the hands of Superman. his own son, Orion, killed him (didn't last, he got better).
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cogadh: Darkseid was technically created as the enemy of the New Gods, Superman just kind of adopted him as an enemy when his war with the New Gods spilled over into Earth. While Darkseid may be more powerful than most of the heroes on Earth, he is certainly not the most powerful being in the DC universe and not just there for Superman to fight. In fact, his final defeat didn't even come at the hands of Superman. his own son, Orion, killed him (didn't last, he got better).
Well he was paired with Thanos in the Marvel/DC crossover and that's pretty high on the power levels. As for not staying dead, that's nothing in the DC universe a good Crysis wont fix ;). Jason Todd was dead and buired once.
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cogadh: Darkseid was technically created as the enemy of the New Gods, Superman just kind of adopted him as an enemy when his war with the New Gods spilled over into Earth. While Darkseid may be more powerful than most of the heroes on Earth, he is certainly not the most powerful being in the DC universe and not just there for Superman to fight. In fact, his final defeat didn't even come at the hands of Superman. his own son, Orion, killed him (didn't last, he got better).
And in the end Batman killed his physical form with a radion bullet and Superman vanished his spiritual form with his super voice :P
I don't think that Superman is not relevant anymore, it's just that most writers don't know what to do with him. You have All-Star Superman as an example of an amazing story that has no problems with a god-like superman (the writer even raises his power level as a result of a trip to the Sun).
The Flashes are also way overpowered but I don't see anybody complaining about them.
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cogadh: Darkseid was technically created as the enemy of the New Gods, Superman just kind of adopted him as an enemy when his war with the New Gods spilled over into Earth. While Darkseid may be more powerful than most of the heroes on Earth, he is certainly not the most powerful being in the DC universe and not just there for Superman to fight. In fact, his final defeat didn't even come at the hands of Superman. his own son, Orion, killed him (didn't last, he got better).
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Delixe: Well he was paired with Thanos in the Marvel/DC crossover and that's pretty high on the power levels. As for not staying dead, that's nothing in the DC universe a good Crysis wont fix ;). Jason Todd was dead and buired once.
The only person in comics to die and stay dead is Uncle Ben; for everyone else, resurrection is fair game.
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OmegaX: The Flashes are also way overpowered but I don't see anybody complaining about them.
All the Justice League members can be considered overpowered compared to counterparts in other comics but in their own universe they fit well enough.
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cogadh: The only person in comics to die and stay dead is Uncle Ben; for everyone else, resurrection is fair game.
Yeah that was a jibe at comics in general not just DC. How many times has Janet Van Dyne died now?
Post edited March 31, 2011 by Delixe
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Delixe: Well he was paired with Thanos in the Marvel/DC crossover and that's pretty high on the power levels. As for not staying dead, that's nothing in the DC universe a good Crysis wont fix ;). Jason Todd was dead and buired once.
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cogadh: The only person in comics to die and stay dead is Uncle Ben; for everyone else, resurrection is fair game.
And to be fair, Zombie Lord Ben would actually be a kind of cool villain, compared to many others:)