I think that was the same spot I gave up on, I died more than 5 times on that puzzle alone

It's even funnier when you just *know* that something is going to kill you and yet, you still wind up being killed by it because of your own actions. There's also those two crushers that play on that particular aspect rather well.

The two crushers are the perfect example of "you have to die to figure out how to survive." That's one reason I think the game is overrated... since when was that type of thing a good thing?

In a game that is arguably about death, it works very well. It also why the second part of that puzzle works.

Depends on the game. There's not many universal rules. In it's way, it's not treating death as a punishment, it's treating death as a simple obstacle. There's no game over screen, no noticeable load time, no long treks between checkpoints.

It's a bunch of simple things that make death really not matter to the player.

I'm not against it because death is annoying, I'm against it because I think it's bad puzzle design.

Because you think death is a fail state? Flinging the little boy to his doom is just a way of figuring out how the puzzle or trap works.

No, because the way you figure out the "puzzle" is to walk into it and die. Then you know next time not to walk into it. Then you walk into the second one and die, then you know it's different. You are not figuring anything out using your brain, you are just learning where to walk through negative feedback.

Figuring out how to not die is more complex than simply "not walk into it."

The crusher trap seems a popular topic. As an example, it's not the crusher trap that's the trick. It's the soldiers following it and realizing you use the crusher trap against them.

Or the swinging bear traps earlier. Go forward, die. Go forward to trigger, then run away, die. Okay, now figure out how to avoid both.

Yes, you figure it out by walking into it and dying. But so what if you figure it out by dying or if you figure it out by losing your block? Then you go back, get a new block and the puzzle resets. It's just a reset mechanism.

Walk the other way! That's my point... you learn where to walk through negative feedback. There is no real puzzle solving.

Doesn't work, the trap springs both directions. The actual trick is in a forward backward shuffle with proper timing. Almost all puzzle games are solvable through a trial and error mechanism. You push forward, see your attempt doesn't work, then try something different. Limbo is no different in this regard. The puzzle is about putting what you learned from the trials to work. And seeing if you can predict some of the failures to bypass them. Limbo includes that as well.

The way I remember it I walked forward and died. So the next time I walked backward, still died. The third time I walked forward, backward, then forward again and I made it. I didn't really solve anything, I just walked the opposite way from when I died.

I don't agree. I am not going to go through every puzzle game in my mind to try and make a broader point, but I don't think they are all based on slapping your wrist so you move your hand the right way.

I honestly cannot think of a single puzzle game that doesn't use failure in one form or another to teach you.

Not just to teach you, I am saying the solution to every puzzle is to walk this way or walk that way and see which way does not kill you.

While death is used to signify failure of a puzzle, the game is no different to any other puzzle game where there is either the correct solution, or the need to restart the level.