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I personally loved Matt Smith (and never got all of the Matt Smith hate/David Tennant worship), but I agree that it's time for some new blood. That said, if John Hurt is going to actually have a permanent role as the Doctor, it'll be really interesting to see what direction Moffatt wants to take it the show for the next few years -- especially if he wants to bring back the Valeyard.
Haha, no. John Hurt is definitely not going to have a permanent role.
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StingingVelvet: it was massively more than any other contemporary show.
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SirPrimalform: Not compared to contemporary shows here. Not to accuse US TV of being homophobic or racist, but isn't it possible that the programmes you're comparing to feature a less than realistic proportion of minority characters? If that's the case, I don't really see how you can criticise Doctor Who for the failings of other programmes.
US shows are integrating LGB characters and interracial relationships as well. LGB are mostly on the cable networks, but there are a few on network TV. However, I have noticed a lot more when watching shows from the BBC. It doesn't bother me, but I have noticed with some programs using it a lot more than others.
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StingingVelvet: <snip>
Read this please: http://jezebel.com/im-biracial-and-that-cheerios-ad-is-a-big-fucking-dea-510740851

It isn't exactly the same, but it makes a very similar point.

The inclusion of minority faces/characters in popular shows (/in the media generally) as more than token characters, where their sexuality, or race, or choice of relationship partner is not their defining characteristic, but just one part of them, is important for societal acceptance of people who are different than the majority.

The reason it doesn't make a difference in the actual quality of the show (which you yourself mention), is exactly why it is important. It validates experiences and lives in a way that media often does not, and it does this in a non intrusive way.
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SirPrimalform: Haha, no. John Hurt is definitely not going to have a permanent role.
Gosh darn he's a good actor though, I particularly liked him in the 1984 adaptation.
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SirPrimalform: Haha, no. John Hurt is definitely not going to have a permanent role.
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Crosmando: Gosh darn he's a good actor though, I particularly liked him in the 1984 adaptation.
I agree, John Hurt is awesome. Actually, I think Hurt would have made an awesome incarnation of Rassilon, or Omega in Doctor Who.
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StingingVelvet: <snip>
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SheBear: Read this please: http://jezebel.com/im-biracial-and-that-cheerios-ad-is-a-big-fucking-dea-510740851

It isn't exactly the same, but it makes a very similar point.

The inclusion of minority faces/characters in popular shows (/in the media generally) as more than token characters, where their sexuality, or race, or choice of relationship partner is not their defining characteristic, but just one part of them, is important for societal acceptance of people who are different than the majority.

The reason it doesn't make a difference in the actual quality of the show (which you yourself mention), is exactly why it is important. It validates experiences and lives in a way that media often does not, and it does this in a non intrusive way.
That ad is great, I love it.

Again it's not about inclusion at all, I wish you guys would curb the reflex to think it is about that. It's about unrealistic quantity making a sledgehammer out of a good point.
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Timelord1963: For the T, Cassandra tells Rose she was born a male; she must have transitioned at some point before becoming the bitchy trampoline because we see her as a female human in New Earth. And there's a short line from the Doctor early in The Doctor's Wife about the Corsair (another Timelord) once changing his gender to female for one regeneration. There's probably some others!
Oh, I completely missed those lines but you are right. I also like to imagine that there are actually many trans people in the future episodes but surgery has advanced so much by then you just wouldn't know by looking.
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StingingVelvet: It's about unrealistic quantity making a sledgehammer out of a good point.
Again, I disagree. It is still actually a pretty conservative representation for such a cosmopolitan place. For instance, Doctor Who hasn't featured Asians, South Asians, Middle Easterners Pacific Islanders, etc, etc. You probably just live in an exceptionally white and closeted place.
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Darling_Jimmy: Again, I disagree. It is still actually a pretty conservative representation for such a cosmopolitan place. For instance, Doctor Who hasn't featured Asians, South Asians, Middle Easterners Pacific Islanders, etc, etc. You probably just live in an exceptionally white and closeted place.
Hahaha... I really don't. Nor do I think a country with a 3% Black population like the UK is "conservatively represented" by having every single companion in the RTD era be in an interracial relationship.

Anyway, agree to disagree.
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StingingVelvet: Hahaha... I really don't. Nor do I think a country with a 3% Black population like the UK is "conservatively represented" by having every single companion in the RTD era be in an interracial relationship.
SheBear was kind enough to compile a list for you so we don't have to cover why you are wrong on the every relationship point. Furthermore, to quote Wikipedia:
20.9 per cent of Londoners are of Asian and mixed-Asian descent. 19.7 per cent of Londoners are of full Asian descent, with those of mixed-Asian heritage comprising 1.2 of the population. Indians account for 6.6 per cent of the population, followed by Pakistanis and Bangladeshis at 2.7 per cent each. Chinese peoples account for 1.5 per cent of the population, with Arabs comprising 1.3 per cent. A further 4.9 per cent of Londoners are classified as "Other Asian".
15.6 per cent of London's population are of Black and mixed-Black descent. 13.3 per cent of Londoners are of full Black descent, with those of mixed-Black heritage comprising 2.3 per cent of the population. Black Africans account for 7.0 per cent of London's population, with 4.2 per cent as Black Caribbean and 2.1 per cent as "Other Black".
5.0 per cent of Londoners are of mixed race.
In January 2005, a survey of London's ethnic and religious diversity claimed that there were more than 300 languages spoken and 50 non-indigenous communities with a population of more than 10,000 in London.
And do keep in mind that the TARDIS travels in both time and space. So that mysterious 3% you desperately cling to is moot, regardless.
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Darling_Jimmy: And do keep in mind that the TARDIS travels in both time and space. So that mysterious 3% you desperately cling to is moot, regardless.
I didn't know only London counted. Not sure why that would be. And even 15% is still not...

Look, whatever. My extremely slight eye roll at the number of minority relationships in RTD Who is nothing compared to my massive frustration with your tone and pompousness throughout this thread, so like I said, can we please agree to disagree?

You can go on feeling like a truly enlightened person surrounded by racists and homophobes and I can go on not giving a shit what you think and watching Doctor Who.
Post edited June 04, 2013 by StingingVelvet
Further to this kind of mindset, where if you think 4 companion relationships in a row being interracial is a Liberal sledgehammer you're being racist, here is a woman who thinks anyone against a female Doctor hates women (taken from Doctor Who forum Gallifrey Base):
The more I read people talking about a female doctor, the more I'm convinced that it needs to happen. They need to understand that this could happen an it would not be the end of the world.

Astounding that they could see any race in the role, but that a woman seems so essentially alien to them that they don't think they could accept it. It just speaks to how much men really do still hate women. They don't see us even as people. We've even had a few posts that write about the fan reaction to a female Doctor like only men are fans, completely ignoring the large female fan base. Its like women just don't exist. That's misogyny at its most pure. Feminism is the radical idea that women are people.
This kind of search for victimhood and hate depresses me.
Post edited June 04, 2013 by StingingVelvet
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SirPrimalform: Haha, no. John Hurt is definitely not going to have a permanent role.
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Crosmando: Gosh darn he's a good actor though, I particularly liked him in the 1984 adaptation.
Oh definitely! It's great that they managed to get him for the anniversary special, but then they are making a big deal out of it. It's supposed to be feature length and shown at cinemas here as well as on TV.
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Darling_Jimmy: And do keep in mind that the TARDIS travels in both time and space. So that mysterious 3% you desperately cling to is moot, regardless.
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StingingVelvet: I didn't know only London counted. Not sure why that would be. And even 15% is still not...
RTD era was incredibly London-centric. Those national averages you were quoting are dragged down by rural populations being almost entirely white. Most cities of a decent size in the UK are very diverse though, I'm not sure where you're getting your ideas of what is and isn't realistic.