This doesn't change my point. I wouldn't trust TorrentFreak coverage of this issue any more than I would trust Fox News coverage of the liberal bias in video games.

It is not pro-piracy. GOG's business depends on making friends with pirates. It is no secret GOG financially supports piracy by paying for ad space on abandonware sites. So they are only "cool with piracy" (to use your words) when it's beneficial? Only when it's someone else's property? They can't play both sides without attracting well deserved criticism.

There is a saying that you catch more flies with honey than with vinegar. Although that is not actually true for flies, it works on people.

While I am not sure where I stand on the issue of abandonware, as best as I understand it abandonware exists in a legal grey area since it is impossible to actually purchase a very large percentage of those games. And, even if you could purchase them, there is no way that they would function on your computer. That just seems a bit different than pirating a brand new game that is easily available for purchase - a purchase , no less, that would give money back to the developer.

Like I said, I'm not sure where I sit on abandonware. I do not use it myself since I'm conflicted over it, but conceptually it seems like the two would be a little bit different legally due to the issue of game availability. If someone has actual functioning legal knowledge on this issue I would be interested in hearing what they have to say on the matter.

In most countries, it is illegal regardless of the author or publisher's willingness to distribute copies. The grey area is in the realm of ethics (as in; it doesn't really hurt anybody so what is the harm?) But one can easily extend that same justification to media currently in distribution (as in; I only made a copy so the publisher hasn't actually lost anything, so what is the harm?)

Anyway, the heart of my message here is that this move surprised a lot of people, given GOG's (let's say) lenient (if not complicit) past. The clever, little rebellious company that carved out a niche for itself between two clashing forces has shaken the confidence of long time customers lately. Piracy may be wrong but a heavy hand is not going to make them see it your way. I always thought GOG knew that.

Fox News isn't a legitimate source of news. They specifically went to court over their right to make news up for broadcast. They are an entertainment channel, nothing more according to their court case.

Just take a look at:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fox_News_Channel_controversies
http://www.philly2philly.com/politics_community/politics_community_articles/2009/6/29/4854/fox_news_wins_lawsuit_misinform_public
Give it a rest. They're not cool with piracy and I've seen GOG links up replacing ones that previously would have gone to pirated materials.

At the end of the day, those sites would be there whether or not GOG was advertising on them. Ultimately if the publishers have opted not to act on it one way or another GOG has no involvement.

It's just sad that you seem to need to hang on to this delusional belief that trying to snag customers that would otherwise be pirating the games is some how hypocritical or even that hypocrisy would even matter.

Wow those are so wildly inaccurate accusations.

Sites hosting 20 old games isn't supporting piracy you dolt. If you look at things black & white, then technically, yes. BUT - anyone with half a brain knows that the reason these sites survive and don't get sued, is because no-one gives a damn about the value of those oldies any more. GOG simply works with those sites to get a large part of their visitors to come to GOG because they share the same community. The fact that GOG survives is evidence that people want to pay for good old games, but often can't find a WAY to do so.

In short: don't be an idiot and compare apples to oranges. Piracy of brand new games is a world of difference with hosting ancient games that are extremely hard to get hold of not to mention even harder to get running if it wasn't for those sites. In essence, Abandonware sites kept the interest in old games alive to make GOG the success it is today. That's not condoning piracy - that's offering an alternative.

Didn't I explain that? Oh yes, I did:

Actually, I covered everything you said. Are you sure you replied to the right person?

WTF are you talking about? How is "trying to snag customers that would otherwise be pirating the games" hypocritical? Trying to prosecute customers they were previously chummy with for the very same activity is hypocritical.

LOL Who said they were?

The OP did.

If you don't think piracy is wrong then why did you pay for GOG's? Just curious.
So you want creators to rely on "good will" and trust that only those who "can't afford it" (totally bogus excuse) are doing it?

Funny because CDPR tried to rely on that "good will" and it didn't work. People still pirated Witcher 2 in droves.

Honestly, if this is your way of thinking, it is very flawed and presumptuous.

The one has absolutely nothing to do with the other. And I never said "piracy is good" or even "piracy isn't bad". I said it isn't a crime. There are a lot of bad things that aren't crimes and vice versa.

That being said I do don't think piracy is bad. At least the kind of piracy that is "kids downloading torrents". E.g., I think it is much worse paying 1$ for PWYW bundles as a person with disposable income.

I buy a lot of GOGs because I support GOG as a distributor and the publishers for making those games possible. I like the way GOG treats me and how they do business. And I like having my games neatly stacked up on the internet.

I don't pirate as much as I did when I was younger, because I simply have the money now. And it's gotten so easy, that the "thrill of the hunt" is gone. But I still pirate the occasional MW game (because 60€ for 4 hour singleplayer is ridicoulus) or "Demo" before buying a game.

Honestly, I think those people on their "morale high horses" are the worst.(Not pointing at anyone in particular here, yet). Worse even than the "bad pirates" . Not only are those people most often hypocritical bigots, but following something just because "it's a rule" without scrutinizing ones actions is often the first step into the line of thinking that leads to "I had my orders".

Discuss this with any judge in any court anywhere in the western world and you'll probably experience that the law says it is.

I don't want to start a new 'how legal is piracy' thread. But I just to point out, that what you say is more an opinion with the true legal point of view probably being the opposite.

You can all discuss whatever you want of course or say what you think what the world should be. But let not fool ourselves about how it is right now. After years of reading piracy threads the justifications never became really good and my guess is that they never will.

Don't forget timppu.

Well, I did. More than once. ;-P. It isn't a criminal offense (Straftat im Sinne des StGB), but it is a "Nebenstraftat" (§ 106 ff. UhrG). And this was only passed "recently"(after '04 and several EU countries haven't made it a minor criminal offense). The codes in the UhrG are not aimed at the "kids torrenting" but real piracy. That is people earning money of other peoples work. Whenever piracy is discussed in politics and legislation is passed it's about counterfit products and the like real piracy , not kids trading games in school.

The legal communtiy has pretty much agreed that the criminalization of those cases is stupid and counterproductive at best. (well, apart from civil law litigators that earn money that way).

I'm not defending piracy! (But I'm not bothered by it and I do it occasionally.) I'm against the method CDP used to "fight piracy". Which is disgusting and useless at best. Heck, I'm not even strictly "anti-DRM" (My last two full price purchases were both Ubisoft titles, and totally worth it,btw)

Agreed....+1 for some very well written sentiments.
But some ip holders ARE a bunch of copyright trolls. ;)
Yup......and piglet too.

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But it isn't a crime, pal(downloading games that is)......true piracy(as SimonG said) where people sell games or financially profit from stolen IP is.

edited